VDP-156: Develop and Launch VItamycin for VitaDAO Token Holders

One-liner: Allocate up to $50,000 to develop a longevity cocktail for distribution to VitaDAO token holders.

Team: Alex Dobrin, Paul, Benji et el

Objective: Develop a scientifically-backed longevity cocktail, advancing VitaDAO’s mission in practical longevity research and exploring innovative ways to deliver value to token holders.

Project Overview: This project aims to create a longevity cocktail combining substances based on existing scientific research in humans. The team will focus on formulation development, leaving distribution and regulatory aspects for future consideration.

Key Deliverables:

  1. Research summary and hypothesis paper
  2. Cocktail formulation
  3. Small-scale prototype production
  4. Post-marketing data collection plan

Implementation Plan:
Literature review and research

  1. Formulation development
  2. Sourcing of high-quality ingredients
  3. Small-scale production for testing
  4. Post-marketing data collection from buyers and rewards in $VITA

Timeline: 3-5 weeks
Budget: Up to $50,000

The team is empowered to make decisions on the specific direction of the research, formulation details, and prototype development within the allocated budget and timeline.

Next Steps:

  1. Conduct comprehensive literature review
  2. Begin formulation development
  3. Identify and contact potential suppliers
    This project positions VitaDAO at the forefront of translating longevity research into practical applications, potentially leading to future opportunities for token holder engagement and value creation.

Additional Direction:

  1. Utilize the Members portal to develop the first product
  2. Commission a study to support the cocktail’s development
  3. Focus on sourcing high-quality ingredients
  4. Emphasize the process of making this cocktail

This project will leverage the VitaDAO community’s expertise through the Members portal, ensuring a collaborative approach to developing our first longevity cocktail. We will commission a targeted study to further support our development efforts and place a strong emphasis on sourcing the highest quality ingredients. The team will document and share the process of making this cocktail, providing valuable insights to the VitaDAO community.

  • Agree
  • Revisions Requested (Detail in Comments)
  • Disagree
0 voters

What kind of study do you have in mind? A quick ‘feed flies and worms the cocktail and see if it helps them’?

Is the cocktail meant to be prescription-only or available supplements?

2 Likes

Absolutely not; where did this idea even come from?

1 Like

I get the rationale for doing something like this, but I feel it’s off the mark regarding VitaDAO’s mission and building community engagement. In my opinion, it seems more like David Sinclair than Peter Fedichev.

2 Likes

I think this would be a metanalysis / lit review, not a commissioned worm / fly expeirment. The goal would be to provide all the evidence to support and refute the final cocktail.

Yeah agree there should be more details here. From what I understand from the conversations - this would be given to members in a research use only context (not for human consumption) with rapamycin and potentially other ingredients as well.

I’m not 100% sure what the genesis of the idea was, but thinking here to my understanding is to be able to provide products to members that helps build the treasury and provide immediate value to members.

Just looked up the stated mission of VitaDAO, which is “Our mission is to support researchers who are working to pre-empt the onset of age-related diseases, and to bring new therapeutics to market that allow people to live longer, healthier lives.” If VitaDAO developed a new cocktail not previously available, would that not be in line with this?


One final word - we know this is certainly atypical for VitaDAO, but we are trying to be creative in how VitaDAO can provide utility to its members in a direct and immediate way other than fund moonshot research that has a long time to manifest into tangible value.

1 Like

I think it’s a great idea. Will it be more like a multivitamin, similar to what Dr. Brad Stanfield does with his MicroViamin, or will it be a more experimental mix of ingredients like NR, sulforaphane, etc.?

1 Like

There’s been a lot of inbound interest in rapamycin, but we want to give the people what they want. A big part of this exercise is hearing what the community wants so we can give it to them. Rapa likely to be optimally dosed weekly so something else dosed weekly is probably optimal to combine it with

It’s a prescription drug.

I don’t see how this would be helpful.

From a sales perspective, just cite the existing literature for whatever compound(s). Meta-analysis won’t help much.

From a science perspective, no one will believe it (with or without a meta-analysis) until you have experimental data supporting the final cocktail improving longevity. Too many potential interactions, etc.

This is a clinical trial, then. I’m all for running decentralized clinical trials by mailing random pills to anons on the internet and convincing them to mail in blood or bloodwork results.

However, there are a ton of legal issues and design/statistics requirements around a clinical trial, and human subjects approvals are required for it in Switzerland, Canada and US. You can apply for NIH grants whose express purpose are designing clinical trials, so this is not trivial.

I would note that it would be easier to build the infrastructure (enrolling, vetting participants) for such a trial by starting with fitness challenges that may not require human subjects approval-- things like fasted cardio or not as the earlier example I used that you didn’t like.

Member base is too small for this. Do the math and the demand test before even worrying about what goes in the cocktail. What margin do you need per unit, and how many monthly purchases do you need of that unit to make it worthwhile vs how many members are there vs how many members would pay for it?

For some quick math, there are 3600 $Vita holders. If 10% of those buy your product, you are trying to build the treasury off 360 monthly purchases. Let’s assume you can sell the month supply for $30. That’s $130k/year in total revenue. Not profit. Total revenue.

If the goal is to raise money for the treasury, you have to sell to normies. Then you’re taking the VitaDAO brand and turning it into part of the supplement business. I’m not saying a pivot from scienceDAO to longevity pill eCom DAO is bad, but that is what happens if the pill is successful.

Nothing in the proposal sounds like market research, which is what it sounds to me like you’re proposing is the purpose.

Overall, I think this could be modified into two distinct proposals.

Proposal 1) Sink $50k into spinning up an eCom business focused on creating a longevity supplement (ie no Rx). Keep the team lean, and give them a total 40% equity (tokenized and private, or not tokenized) in the biz as their pay. If any are US based, provide the docs for the 83b election, or similar tax advantages if such exist in Canada/Switzerland/etc. You can probably do this anon if the US based team members set up a Wyoming LLC, and Molecule or VitaDAO contracts with the LLC. No idea how it works in other countries.

First deliverables are a landing page, paid ads, content as needed, and a demand test to gauge interest and target audience. No go until the paid ads and landing page/site generate the necessary demand.

Second deliverables are content pages about compounds and activities that promote longevity, proposed formulation as a supplement blend, and manufacturer. Formulation then needs to be tested on members/volunteers and tweaked for taste, appearance, water solubility, etc. Once optimized, launch and focus everything on increasing revenue, and then slowly disburse back to the team/VitaDAO as it scales.

Proposal 2) Develop a decentralized or web-based system to enroll human participants in health challenges, and measure biomarkers. Maybe Vita membership is part of this. Maybe not. But build the infrastructure from which decentralized clinical trials could be launched. There are a ton of influencers who could convince people to enroll in a clinical trial if they believed in it or were curious about it. Fitness X in particular. this will drive the engagement you want. 4 week, 8 week, 10 week challenges are fun, and keep people talking.

The main challenge is logistic-- getting an interface, getting people to enroll, getting people to follow the #&#* protocol, collecting data, vetting data, and then handling biospecimens, mailing supplements, etc. But this could be built as a platform, and revenue come to the DAO from allowing others to use it (possibly in a permissionless manner if we stay true to web3 ethos). It would be a web3 clinical trial fundamental, much like the IPT is a web3 IP fundamental.

In the meantime, brainstorming the best Rx longevity cocktail can be done, and then an IPT for that, if possible. But need experimental data and/or clinical trial infrastructure first. Also, not sure if combos are harder to patent due to ‘obviousness’ and overlap with existing patents, especially if both drugs show activity.

1 Like

If it were me I’d like to see something interesting like a probiotic that expresses GLP-1 peptides and other longevity (TBD) molecules. Something that doesn’t rely on prescription drugs, likely to be safe, and could actually do something. Just my two cents.

1 Like

Do any of the probiotics last more than a day in the human gut?

There are several strains that do. There was a recent paper published on this. Separately, given that there are daily orals there is a likelihood of having efficacious pk.

1 Like

Good to know they’re starting to solve that problem.

Thought GLP-1 peptides had a terrible time crossing the intestines, which was the main barrier to doing insulin as a pill.

1 Like

Thank you guys for the proposal and for all the efforts to increase value for tokenholders; however, on this one I voted “disagree”

These are my reservations

  1. While I understand that there might be a lot of inbound interest in rapamycin, why focus on something that can easily be prescribed by any doctor in the world? Let’s even assume we make this cocktail: what is preventing tokenholders from going to a pharmacist and ask to make this combination for them? Or as an alternative (if there is any regulation forbidding this) buy the ingredients and doing it themselves at home.
  2. If we want to increase the short-term value of the token, why not leverage what already exists in the longevity community, may be providing discounts for supplements (e.g., Novos, Avea, etc.) or more advanced treatments? For example this company (https://www.pristineregenerativenexus.com/) will soon start operating with several advanced regenerative medicine therapies in Prospera.
  3. it seems we are looking for rational solutions to increase the price of the token, but let’s not forget that irrationality plays a big part in it. i would rather see these 50K invested in another project on Catalyst. it is true that projects in science do not have the same speed than in traditional crypto. But if VitaDAO and Molecule can work together to fund 20-30 projects in the next few months (and i believe that if we finally start again to execute we can achieve that) we might be able to have monthly or even biweekly updates on our portfolio and create a lot of hype around it.

If we actually want to go in this direction of creating supplements or similar for our community, I think that both @bowtiedshrike and @mykalt45 brought up good ideas that are worth considering. The first thing I would do is changing the name from Vitamycin to something else so that we don’t get too fixated on rapamycin.

1 Like

I like this idea - bacteria genetically modified to express longevity proteins. We already surfaced it and we had a concrete opportunity with Zbiotics a while ago:

They have the technology to do it and, while they were using it for their anti-hangover supplement, they were open to apply it to longevity proteins.

It didn’t look like their microbes lasted more than a day or two.

The paper I was referring to. A good place to start regarding strains that may be longer lasting.

3 Likes

Can it be specified which pod’s mandate the proposal falls under? Looking at VDP-148, it’s hard to tell whether it’s even within the scope of either pod.